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Switch to Forum Live View ENGLAND'S WORLD CUP 23 are...
11 months ago  ::  16 May 18 08:00 PM #1
Paul C
Posts: 533
Date Joined: Jul 30, 2015
Status: I would like to VIST the planet 'PLUTO' :)
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Butland, Pope, Pickford.


Trent Alexander-Arnold
Ashley Young

MIDFIELDERS (5) yup you read that right FIVE!!!

Ruben Loftus-Cheek



Your 23 that hopefully will bring the World Cup back to ENGLAND again?

Now you might think that the !!! means i'm shocked & or annoyed, well there are things to discuss if any of you folks would like too?

Actually if you look at the players choosen, there are NOT too many surprises with who he has available.

Starting with the GOALKEEPERS...

Joe Hart did not make it onto the plane & for me that is the right move.
The 3 left are much the same i think, no one stands out as being the TOP No1 England keeper.
For me the guy on the standby list is the the BEST GK we have and that's...Heaton of Burnley but he lost his place to POPE and never got it back.
So who for that Number 1 spot...he needs to make it NOW & stick with him.
A year or two ago it would have been BUTLAND, now the majority would perhaps say PICKFORD? but i'd plum for POPE of Burnley (he must be doing something right to keep HEATON out right?)


That is some figure, although in truth it's probably dictated by the AMOUNT of QUALITY Midfield players we have...with 2 of these defenders really known as Midfielders (so he's picking these 2 with this in mind perhaps? those 2 are Delph of City & Young of United who have both been playing back there most of this season)
These 2 players can double up as both Defender or Midfielder.
So Southgate's LOGIC is not lost on me but there are OTHER WAYS HE COULD HAVE GONE...which i'll come to in a mo.

As for these defenders?
Some may think themselves fortunate to be heading to Russia, perhaps?
I'm thinking Trent Alexander-Arnold? but good luck to him & well done & Ashley Young (the fact he can also play in midfield may have been the deciding factor with him?)
The rest seem like logical choices...but who will be the 4? or 3? to start?

Well that's what it's being listed as on the BBC.
Already addressed this somewhat in that both DELPH & YOUNG can double up as MIDFIELD players (so that makes 7...if needed in those roles with injuries? or tactics?) but also STERLING has been listed as a STRIKER? well i have no doubt he could do this but he's really an attacking CENTRAL midfielder...even ex ENGLAND boss might agree (Roy) that he played him in the WRONG area of the pitch last time.

So those 5 are ALL obvious picks.
But we could add DELPH, YOUNG & STERLING making 8 which now doesn't sound SO CRAZY!!!

But should he have taken less defenders? so as to provide 1 or 2 more MIDFIELDERS?

I would say YES...i'd have left YOUNG & probably TRENT ALEXANDER-ARNOLD back at home (hope they prove me wrong though) with these 2 removed i think the remaining 8 are enough?

Those 2 defender slots should for me have been taken up by 2 more midfielders in the shape of...

PHIL FODEN...i know he's young, i know he's not played too much for CITY but as the boss stated he's been here training with these fella's (Debruyne, Silva's (both of 'em) Sterling, Sane, Yaya (goodbye BIG FELLA...and THANKS) and was told he deserves his winning medal.
FODEN is a GAME CHANGER even though he's young.
I know i shouldn't be surprised but a little bit of me was...esepcially when you wonder...
Are Arnold & Young GAME CHANGERS? maybe? but i think FODEN really is.

Crying shame for WILSHIRE...he could have been our XAVI or INIESTA but injuries have just made him too much of a risk, i understand the decision & sadly have to agree with it.

Same goes for LALANA...another i am a fan of, again perhaps just not fit enough? and time caught him out, such a shame.

Which is WHY??? i am a bit peeved that FODEN did not make it onto the plane & so with us lacking in midfield players who have actually been playing there this season why not take a calulated risk on someone like SHELVEY? i understand some believe him to be TOXIC in the dressing room & has something of an attitude problem? if that is true then perhaps Southgate made the correct choice? if this is not true & looking at that midfield (which is GOOD but lacking in numbers) WHY did he not make it?
Seems to me Southgate believes the fair enough i suppose.

ALL 5 are capable & GOOD with 2 of them being TRUE WORLD CLASS...
Harry Kane has a GREAT CHANCE of winning the GOLDEN BOOT & getting the goals needed for us to go very close (if not win it?) but for that to happen Mr STERLING will need to continue his top class form & add to the goals & provides...if he does then these 2 guys could both go close to winning that piece of GOLD & getting ENGLAND to the QF's at least?
RASHFORD i like a lot but he's not getting the game time at United, VARDY is almost world class & his pace at his age is frightening to defenders (will he start? perhaps in a game or two but he could be dynamite as a sub)
WELBECK may consider himself fortunate to be included? but he does hold the ball up well if not quiet as deadly as the other four in on goal.

ALL in ALL you can't argue too much with the picks?

I mean there is no LAMPARD, GERRARD, ROBSON, GASGOIGNE etc that's been left at home but then again those types never quiet did it for it ENGLAND.
Southgate seems to be concentrating on THE TEAM & in them GETTING ON TOGETHER (no stupid CLICKS within the GROUP) and PLAYING FOOTBALL the RIGHT (EXCITING) WAY.
If we go out then hopefully it will be in the right manner...GOING FOR IT?

My issues are mainly with the LOW MIDFIELD real need for 10 defenders surely? but i understand why he's done it with the two that double up but surely he could have made do with 8 Defenders? and added 2 more midfielders to this squad?

FODEN & WILSHIRE would have been in my SQUAD had WILSHIRE been in good nick or LALLANA but again, injuries and the like so perhaps SHELVEY? but as i say he might be right on why he made this choice? as he's not even in the STANDBY LIST.

So i guess what i am saying is...

This SQUAD is a little short of IN DEPTH QUALITY so what could he do?
HEATON's ommision is understandable but i still think he's the BEST of the 4 GK's.
FODEN would have been a calulated risk but one i would have taken as he's a GAME CHANGER (you need those) 
And perhaps he's right over WILSHIRE, LALLANA & SHELVEY.

So we go with WHAT WE HAVE GOT...and to be FAIR the 1 to 11 TEAM reads rather well i think & with some luck, no injures, no injustices i'd expect it to reach the Quarter Finals & then it's much as muchness...we are comparable to GERMANY, FRANCE, ARGENTINA & even SPAIN & BRAZIL so i give us every chance of winning this.

We have som SUPER, PROMISING YOUNGSTERS coming up in the Under 17's, 18's, 21's WORLD CUP winning YOUNGSTERS, our WOMEN finished 3rd!!!

It's time for this GROUP of fella's to step up to the plate & show we are capable once more of matching & finally beat these BIG Teams as these sides above have done.

For what it's worth my ENGLAND STARTING 11 would probably look something like this (and i don't think it would be that different from too many others out there?)

1) POPE 
8) LINGARD or DIER? (depending on opposition)
10) KANE

ROSE for DELPH perhaps? sadly STONES is not quiet the DEFENDER i hoped he would become and so Maguire might get the nod (although Southgate does like Stones)
Most of the MIDFIELDERS are going to get GAME TIME Laughing with only 5 on the list, praying ALLI gets his GROOVE on & doesn't DIVE anymore...let's win it FAIR & SQUARE fellas.

Is this a side capable of winning this WORLD CUP? YES i think it is.
They say it's more difficult to win the EURO's? ok, so PORTUGAL did this & they actually won very few of those games & played BLAH...that side of theirs is in NO WAY SUPERIOR to this one of ENGLAND's listed here.

So yes we can win it but as with most sides that do we shall need LUCK at some point in the tournament.

I just hope we GO FOR IT...there's GOALS in this SIDE with KANE, STERLING, ALLI, LINGARD & VARDY, solid hard working, ball winning Midfielders in HENDERSON & LOFTUS CHEEK, Defence is on a PAR with the other BIG NAMES.
Perhaps just that Goalkeeper place is worrying me...HOPE he goes with POPE & he gets DIVINE INTERVENTION Innocent

COME ON ENGLAND...Time to come GOOD.

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11 months ago  ::  17 May 18 11:59 AM #2
Paul C
Posts: 533
Date Joined: Jul 30, 2015
Status: I would like to VIST the planet 'PLUTO' :)
Rank: Royal Flush
Super press conference by Gareth Southgate (ENGLAND Manager) today.

That figure of just 33% of English players to choose from in the PREMIERSHIP makes for chilling reading.

Hence the lack of Midfielders (although what we have is i think good) will be hoping Rubens Loftus-Cheek can play like he did against Brazil & Germany in those friendlies, still a little worried by Alli but he's beginning to find his form, perhaps the friendlies will get him clicking again with his club teammate Harry (KANE)

TRUST in THE YOUNGSTERS i will...hell one of our younger England sides (U-18's i think it was, watched it but can't remember if it was the U-17? U-21's? or the U-18's side? they have ALL won it) they came back from being 0-2 down vs SPAIN and in GREAT STYLE & FEARLESSNESS won 5-2.

"FEARLESS" loved that, young & fearless...GO FOR IT FELLAS, Win it in ATTACKING STYLE or fail to do so trying (NOT SUCH A BAD WAY TO GO OUT if we if at least give it our ALL)

Encouraging News Conference.
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11 months ago  ::  17 May 18 07:26 PM #3
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Date Joined: Aug 2, 2011
Rank: Royal Flush

I agree with alot of what you said in first post m8 apart from Foden.  While he is one for the future, Southgate could not justify bringing him with only 5 apps most from bench.  Im sure the next world cup the call will come for him if he develops the way City expect.

The only changes I would make is leave Young and Arnold out and bring Milner and Bertrand.  I would have brought Shelvey too as he has a good eye for the pass and I still think Liverpool made a big mistake letting him go.  His disciplinary problems are well documented but he has held his hands up and got help and its so far done him the world of good.  The only thing is I could not decide who to leave out instead.

I would start with Pope in goal as Pickford worries me if Im honest and Pope is an all round solid keeper.

Whether I agree or not with Southgates choices I like his thinking and like the way he is doing things his way and not like the others who just followed a template.  The very definition of stupidity is to do the same thing and expect different results.

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11 months ago  ::  18 May 18 06:52 PM #4
Paul C
Posts: 533
Date Joined: Jul 30, 2015
Status: I would like to VIST the planet 'PLUTO' :)
Rank: Royal Flush
Good to hear from you again John (hope you'll be posting plenty here over the WORLD CUP Tournament?) it's always good reading your postings & replies.

And well i cannot disgree with your disagreements (if you know what i mean) Smile

BTW before i come to these i made a slight error in saying the likes of Lampard, Gerrard, Robson, Gazza & many more like Beckham NEVER DID IT for England...what it should have read was that they didn't manage to WIN ANYTHING with England despite the so called TALENTED GOLDEN GENERATION from the 90's & 00's.

I fully understand your stand on FODEN and your sound reasoning for not including him, most i am sure would agree with you as yes others have played & probably done enough to be in front of him.
But i stand by my choice, i'd have taken FODEN, i saw each & every game he played in that tournament & he was terrific, winning the ball, running forward with the ball & taking players on, providing perfectly timed passes & providing & scoring goals that WON us that WORLD CUP at U-18 level? (i think that's right U-18? we won ALL 3 U-17, U-18 & U-21 amazing really!) so a risk? no not really? too young? perhaps? others who deserved the place more based on the season? yeah i think your right with this but i would have gambled on him in place of one of those defenders.

So we shall have to agree to disagree on this one.

We do agree on the leaving the Young & Arnold out (but who knows? perhaps one or both will go on to be GAME CHANGERS? just don't see it) so i'm with you here.

Milner is a great choice...LOVE the guy, a very underestimated player, couldn't believe it when CITY let him go! but he was playing only sporadically & he wanted weekly game time & LIVERPOOL gave him that.
The thing is he RETIRED from International Football didn't he? i'd have still gone for FODEN & WILSHIRE as my 2 picks over these guys but MILNER & or SHELVEY would make sense too but one is now retired & the other (even though he admits his past problems) perhaps just cannot change his spots...otherwise he would at least be on the STANDBY LIST.

Michael Carrick recently stated he did NOT ENJOY going to these TOURNAMENTS & that he was in a BAD PLACE when he did...Sad to read really, this should NOT be the case.

Hopefully ALL the players PICKED want to be there? if not tell the manager now, we won't think ill of you & someone can be drafted in who is ok & wants to be there.

We need these guys (even though they are RICH & PAMPERED) to ENJOY the Experience & to find it FUN & i think & hope that manager SOUTHGATE is well aware of this & leaving Shelvey out was perhaps partly due to the FEEL GOOD VIBE of this current SQUAD?
Just a thought, although Shelvey might feel a little unfortunate to not even make the standby list.

POPE for Goalkeeper? i hope you & i are right? still think HEATON did very little wrong (except get injured & then POPE took his chance & did such a good job...7th & EUROPA FOOTBALL for BURNLEY is OUTSTANDING...that he kept the GK place at Burnley)

Yeah, Pickford is a worry & not just because of the most reent blunder.

I remember KEN & i having a discussion as to who might become the next manager of ENGLAND after ROY departed & i did stupidly think to mention bringing back HODDLE! forgetting (it was a mind wipe! i simply forgot somehow) why he was sacked in the first place!
Unforgivable & Ken was right to pick me up on it.
I quickly U-Turned on that one but i think we both mentioned Gareth Southgate after having managed the U-21 with good success, i mentioned having him as No2 whilst i think? again memory allowing that Ken went for him as the actual manager?

If he did? HE WAS RIGHT...Quailification went smoothly & YOUR RIGHT JOHN...
He listens, he studies, he is a THINKER & does appear to be doing it his way (you have to tread your own path & hope & believe it's the right one)

Manager Southgate to me certainly seems to have adopted the GUARDIOLA / POCHITINHO style of FOOTBALL...and that's GREAT NEWS.

Not ALL football matches are exciting & how we would like to see them but i think he is trying to do it the right way...we keep the ball well thesedays (and that was half the problem) we seem to win it back pretty quickly too, he seems to favour the 3 at the back which is BOLD & in so doing favours ATTACKING, ATTRACTIVE FOOTBALL.

If we lose playing this way? i can live with it.

I have GREAT HOPES John, it's no secret i've gone for ENGLAND to WIN this thing! & backed them too & i also think HARRY KANE could win the GOLDEN BOOT even if we don't make the Final? 17-1 is a great price i think, even had a little on STERLING who is well capable of getting 2 goals a game against better opposition than TUNISA & PANAMA (with all respect)

If ENGLAND don't win it then i want IRELAND too...DOH! damn! maybe next time, truly gutted we have no other British sides going or the Republic.

SPAIN are my favourites, followed by BRAZIL of course & then ???

Seriously anyone could beat anyone of the other top sides...

England CAN beat Argentina, Belgium, Germany, France, Portugal so even though i make those two above favourites (favourites don't always win) i can see a way of getting to the Final and winning it.

One things for sure...ENGLAND are DUE a GREAT TOURNAMENT.

I just hope they do as Southgate says & show NO FEAR & GO FOR IT...if they do we won't be far away.

Interesting Stat...NO ENGLISH REFREE at this WORLD CUP....Geezzz
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11 months ago  ::  18 May 18 07:12 PM #5
Paul C
Posts: 533
Date Joined: Jul 30, 2015
Status: I would like to VIST the planet 'PLUTO' :)
Rank: Royal Flush
Oh one last thing...

As well as SHEARER (who i love as both a FOOTBALLER & PUNDIT) saying England cannot win this World Cup we can now add a growing list of TERRY BUTCHER, the original CAGED TIGER himself who has also said we cannot win the World Cup.

Like both of these guys...

But SORRY that just does not wash with me.

I understand, at this time, it will be difficult, it's the 3rd youngest side ever sent to the World Cup (but we have to look at this as a GOOD THING)

Also it's in RUSSIA...climate should be PERFECT for the likes of us.

We Quailfied from a somewhat tricky Group with flying colours (yup we've done this before & then crashed & burned at the Tournament itself) so should give us reason to think we should be there or thereabouts.

Portugal??? WON the EURO CHAMPIONSHIPS last time out!!! scoring very few goals & winning little of the matches (drawing a good number & going through on penalties)

Add in probably the best STRIKER (currently) in the WORLD in KANE & great support from STERLING, ALLI if back in the mood could be a revelation at this tournament if he wants to? and a SOLID CENTRAL MIDFLIELD PARTERSHIP of Henderson & Rubens Loftus-Cheek.

We might not have the BOOBY MOORE type defender / Captain type (BTW i'd give it to KANE) but there are slight hints of the team of '66 about it? perhaps.

Let's be honest...SHEARER & BUTCHER may well be proved to be correct but i just don't agree that we have no chance & will not win this World Cup.

Damn John i'm gonna risk looking a fool in a few months time but i do think we will WIN this thing!
The only 2 or 3 sides that i would say we would not start favourites against would be BRAZIL, SPAIN & perhaps ARGENTINA? (due to the MESSI factor) the bookies might disagree with this? and have GERMANY, FRANCE & BELGIUM ahead of us (which they do in the betting) but i think we are on at least a par with these & might just edge these now...we'll need too.
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11 months ago  ::  18 May 18 07:31 PM #6
Paul C
Posts: 533
Date Joined: Jul 30, 2015
Status: I would like to VIST the planet 'PLUTO' :)
Rank: Royal Flush
Some might take issue with the...there's a hint of the '66 team / squad about this ENGLAND side?

Well what i really mean by that is...there seems to be a FEEL GOOD VIBE within this GROUP OF PLAYERS but even more importantly they seem to PLAYING AS A TEAM (and not individuals) and that has to be a GOOD THING.

Will it be enough this time out? only time will tell but i will be disappointed if we don't make the Quarter Finals at least (at this point it will become more difficult) but i could see us getting past this stage & on to the SEMI-FINALS & then who knows?

Just EXCITED...i always get EXCITED when a WORLD CUP or EURO's shows up.

I guess it just takes me back to those days in the park playing football for FUN (not money) & simply enjoying it.

Remember playing for our school junior side & heading off to a special indoor 5-a-side structure to play the champions of our area at DINNER TIME (Noon) and we were being hammered, 4-0 down with about 3 minutes left, simply turned to our skip & said get me the ball & i'll just shoot from distance...GOT a HAT-TRICK in under 2 of those minutes but simply ran out of time but at least we didn't go down without a fight (albeit a 3 minute fight Laughing) JUST GOT to HOPE ENGLAND do this also.
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